There’s no inline upgrade between v16 to v17. v16 and lower run on a completely different OS.
Nenad small correction. For 15 years FreePBX Distro has ALWAYS had in place upgrades. We upgraded from CentOS4 to CentOS5, CentOS5 to CentOS6 and CentOS6 to CentOS7 in place without a reinstall. This is the first time that a reinstall is required. So lets make sure we state the correct facts when making statements about things in the past please.
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With other applications that moved to different OS’s I have had automated upgrade tools available for Cloud installations, even when the app has switched to a new OS. eClincalworks is just one example. Cyberlink is a Sangoma product, as is SIPstation. Given that these are paid applications (with several of our clients paying Sangoma upwards of $1k a month for hosting and SIP trunking) as well as annual “maintenance” fees for add-on modules that stop working when other modules are updated even though they have paid for 25-year licenses. IMO Sangoma should have been proactive in building an automated tool for saving the configuration and reinstalling with Debian. My clients are not exactly thrilled with all of the extra billing charges for this migration, not to mention the other recent changes at Sangoma. I am frankly exploring migrating SIP trunking to Flowroute and/or Telnex and switching the accounts to another platform - Issabel, FreeSwitch, or even 3CX come to mind. If I have to put a significant number of billable hours into migrating FreePBX cloud systems, It’s probably time better spent moving the client to another platform and away from Sangoma altogether. That is far easier to justify the billable hours for the client. I already have had one client (65 phones) migrate off of Sangoma, (Cyberlink hosted FreePBX, Sangoma Connect, and Sip Station) to a proprietary platform (Weave) that even provided the phones at no additional cost AND handles the 10DLC provisioning AND at a price point that was LESS than what they were paying for all of Sangoma’s services and add-ons. The factor that pushed them over the edge was that Cyberlink for years included the full version of EPM with their hosting, then without informing us in advance, Sangoma took that away in version 16. Heck, even at several other installations that were all Digium phones on hosted platforms as well as on prem I had to put in support tickets just to get EPM re-enabled for those.
Sangoma is just not nearly the value proposition that many competitors are currently, and especially not the value proposition that FreePBX was before Sangoma’s takeover. And BTW, I’ve been installing FreePBX since 2002, and originally the FREE in FreePBX meant free as in no cost, not the Orwellian rebranding that Sangoma has implemented. “The “Free” in FreePBX stands for Freedom” ? Freedom for WHAT when Sangoma is only pushing their own tools? Just about every current SIP/Astrix system provides configuration flexibility. Maybe Sangoma should just change the name of their version of FreePBX to SangomaPBX and like with Java, SugarCRM, and OpenOffice, encourage a true “open source” fork.
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Something I don’t quite understand is why Sangoma switched to Debian instead of one of the CentOS forks like Rocky Linux or AlmaLinux which provide a community-supported successor to CentOS Linux? Both are open-source enterprise operating systems designed to be 100% compatible with Red Hat Enterprise Linux.
As far as I can discern, upgrading from CentOS 7 to Rocky Linux would have been little more difficult to implement than upgrading from CentOS 6 to 7.
To address another assertion made here, Debian and RHL are not “completely different” operating systems. Both use the same Linux kernel. Virtually every other Linux app can be installed on either distro with no loss of functionality; it is simply a matter of choosing which Linux disro you are using when you download the app to obtain the correct package format (RPM and YUM/DNF or DEB and dpkg/APT) whether it is installing Worpress, Open Office, Java RT, or virtually any of the popular open source Linux apps. In fact, most distros, whether they are Debian-based or RHL-based, include the same suite of popular open-source apps, and that is true even for open-source apps from projects far, far smaller than FreePBX/Asterix.
Why was Debian chosen over one of the stable RHEL forks like Fedora or Rocky Linux anyway? And would not in-place upgrades be viable with say Rocky Linux which took over the Centos project? So why the switch to Debian and not to one of the RHEL/Centos forks?
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Don’t you mean IBM forks (they bought RedHat 6 years ago) ?
Me, I’m using rolling Debian since Wheezy (7) only Open Source FreePBX, never a problem. Maybe a reboot every couple of years
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I’m referring to Red Hat Enterprise Linux forks. Centos was always to my knowledge the Community Edition of RHL. RHL open source actually was absorbed by Fedora when Red Hat’s open source was discontinued and Red Hat went all commercial with RHL
enterprise. Red Hat Linux Enterprise is still RHL enterprise, irrespective of who now owns it.
Which reminds me that Fedora is also a fork of Centos (formerly RHL Community Edition) Rocky Linux took over the Centos project when Centos discontinued it to focus on Centos Stream.
In any event, a significant difference between Debian and Centos (and the other RHL forks) is how packages are distributed. CentOS (and CentOS Stream and RHEL derivatives) uses the RPM package format and YUM/DNF as the package manager. Debian uses the DEB package format and dpkg/APT as the package manager. This is probably a significant reason why FreePBX 17 isn’t able to provide in-place upgrades from previous versions of FreePBX.
But it still doesn’t answer my question as to why the switch to Debian and not to one of the RHEL/Centos forks.
Most other major open-source Linux server-side applications (like WordPress, SuiteCRM, JAVA, Open Office) have package installations for both RPM and DEB package managers.
Primarily because I support a number of commercial applications that are distributed with RHEL, I prefer RHL based Linux distributions for servers, although Debian distros are more popular for LAMP configurations. For workstations, many of the Debian-based distros have more bells and whistles and features that emulate Windows or even OSX. But realistically, only a limited number of commercial vertical market client apps are supported by Linux or even OSX. That is especially true with medical-related applications like Practice Management and Electronic Medical Records systems. Microsoft pretty much has the client-side apps for those vertical markets (and many others like commercial financial analysis applications) hostage.
I’m generally not one for conspiracy theories, but sometimes I feel like Sangoma is intentionally crippling FreePBX.
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As for the migration on Cyberlink’s FreePBXHosting.com (which AGAIN is a SANGOMA product jointly controlled by Cyberlink and Sangoma), if it is as involved as you indicate, and we will end up having to reconfigure for a new static WAN IP, we might as well switch hosting to Akamai Linodes where we already host clients’ SuiteCRM and WordPress installations. It’s certainly price-competitive with Cyberlink/Sangoma’s FreePBXHosting.com. The advantage of FreePBXHosting.com was the ease of installation and the complete distros (basically “one click” provisioning), as well as the previously included full EPM module. Those advantages are no longer there, so there is no incentive for remaining hosted on Cyberlink’s FreePBXHosting.com, other than inertia.
FreePBX used to be a super simple application to set up that even a home user could do, whether cloud-hosted or installed locally on a Rasberry Pi from a flash drive. Smaller businesses didn’t need an IT tech or actual knowledge of Linux to set up FreePBX in the past. I suspect at times that Sangoma’s game plan includes driving those users to PBXACT or SwitchVox and away from FreePBX.
What prevents Sangoma from building complete “one-click” distros for Debian, or for Fedora for that matter?
No Response? All I hear are the crickets.
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Why do you keep on claiming this? Where do you see that Cyberlink is owned by Sangoma?
https://www.cyberlynk.net/hosted-applications/voip-hosting/freepbx-hosting/
I see a partnership, but not that Cyberlink’s hosting is a “Sangoma product”…
Actually, I am referring to a specific Cyberlynk product, freepbxhosting.com which was a joint product between Cyberlynk and Smooze. Sangoma purchased Smooze in 2015, which included Smooze’s stake in freepbxhosting.com.
“FreePBXhosting.com is the ONLY FreePBX hosting provider approved by Sangoma in North America! FreePBXHosting.com is run by CyberLynk and Sangoma through a very close knit partnership.”
That partnership includes joint ownership of freepbxhosting.com, and freepbxhosting.com is in fact a Sangoma “product.”
Doesn’t seem that way from what you have quoted. Would love to have a Sangoma representative explain the partnership.
It doesn’t seem what way? Are you asserting that Sangoma does not have joint ownership and control of freepbxhosting.com through its purchase of Smooze? Tony Lewis can probably provide clarification - as I recall he was part of the Smooze team before the sale to Sangoma.
Unless if you were hosting your VMs on a HyperV.
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I’m not asserting anything. I’m seeking clarification. Neither the information you posted nor the sites I linked indicate ownership by Sangoma.
" FreePBXHosting.com is run by CyberLynk AND Sangoma through a very close knit partnership."
What do you think “Partnership” means exactly? And given that the Cyberlynk website clearly stated that FreePBXhosting “is run by CyberLynk AND Sangoma” how do you discern that FreePBXHosting is NOT a Sangoma “product” when in fact they are jointly actually RUNNING it? In fact, PBXacthosting was also originally developed jointly by Cyberlynk and Smooze, and Sangoma acquired Smooze’s interest in that as well when it purchased the assets of Smooze.
A little history. Sangoma Completes the Acquisition of Two Businesses - Sangoma Technologies
According to the terms of the partnership and joint control (ownership?) of the FreePBXHosting brand and website, Smooze (now Sangoma) was to provide the FreePBX distros and support for the distros on Cyberlynk’s servers. The migration issues are a FreePBX issue, not necessarily a Cyberlynk issue. BTW I never said that Sangoma “owned” freePBXhosting." I stated that freepbxhosting is a Sangoma product - putatively supported by Sangoma. I doubt that Smooze entered into the original partnership out of charity. They more likely shared in the revenues with Cyberlink as part of the joint control and ownership.
Again, Tony Lewis (tonyclewis on these forums) can possibly provide some clarification as to the relationship between Sangoma and Freepbxhosting (and pbxacthosting) given his connection to Smooze prior to Sangoma’s purchasing Smooze and the Smooze assets. And as Ned Corbic mentioned in a previous comment, Sangoma is apparently managing the migration of PBXact installations on PBXact cloud, although I’m unsure if Ned is referring to pbxact cloud generically or to the specific platform pbxact.cloud and whether that is a separate entity from pbxacthosting.com. There is not a lot of transparency going on at Sangoma currently.
If you go to the “legal” link on the pbxact.cloud website, it takes you to a “Page not found” on the Sangoma website, as does the “Privacy Policy” link.
I can not legally comment on the details of ownership of freepbxhosting.com. That would require Sangoma to comment at this point.
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You might enjoy trying the new ISO which for at least the INT spice level is fairly FAI – six EDIT: three clicks in GRUB: a, i, y – if booting in UEFI on DHCP with internet access and working DNS. (EDIT: it is six clicks in Legacy boot mode because you have to hit Enter after each letter, but only three clicks in UEFI boot mode.)
LOL. Just how would I “enjoy” having to boot into Linux and manually run the install process versus the much simpler previous (V16 and earlier) ISO installation and the previous inline upgrades? That also does not solve the issue of upgrading existing cloud installations on freepbxhosting.com. Are you really serious or were you trying to be funny with the “You might enjoy trying” comment?
And WTF is "INT spice level "? And what do you mean by “FAI?” I come from an engineering background. A First Article Inspection (FAI) is a production validation process for verifying that a new or modified production process produces conforming parts.
BTW, your new ISO is BETA. Are you really expecting us to deploy a BETA product on a production install ???
You are correct. But that was out of our control but I stand corrected.